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Hi, I'm new to the forum

I have had an Australian bass for about 3 years and I need to upgrade

I've found a range of ponds from 800l-1200l

I plan to stock:

2 x Archerfish

1 x Snakehead gudgeon

1 x Australian Bass

I'm massive fan of natives and I am wondering if there is anything that I could add?

It doesn't matter if it isn't native but that would be preferred

The pond will be heated, and the 1200 litre's dimension are 175cm x 118cm x 60cm

Thanks, catfishcrazy

Edited by catfishcrazy

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Snakehead may jump out unless the pond is covered. Eeltails that don't get too big and will help keep the substate turned over could be an option. Silver Scats if they are kept in a group.. lots options really depending on the setup of the pond.

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There are lots of species that could work but it depends on how the pond is going to be set up. With larger natives that get aggressive they are generally best raised together from a small size. Trying to put new fish into a tank / pond with established territories can cause issues. So many potential native species available it really just depends on what you like. Personally a large pond with huge silver scats, Spangled Gudegons, Catfish, Adult Rainbows and a small Grunter/s (depending on species) does it for me - each to their own though.

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Thanks, if the fish are all added at the same time, will that help with aggression?

Also we have 3 rendahls in with the bass at the moment and I'm wondering whether they could go in?

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Thanks, if the fish are all added at the same time, will that help with aggression?

Also we have 3 rendahls in with the bass at the moment and I'm wondering whether they could go in?

The fish ideally need to grow up together if its natives that develop territories that we are talking about. Catfish should be fine so long as they are of sufficient size to avoid being eaten. If you want schooling fish that size consider non aggressive species like Mullet etc however these will eat many plants.

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Okay, will scats eat all plant matter?

Because I was thinking

1 x Bass

2 x Archerfish

1 x Snakehead gudgeon

? x Red Scats

Or

A group of banded grunters (or something like them)?

Would a small grunter species work?

Edited by catfishcrazy

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As outlined in your other post - all territorial natives can be aggressive. It comes down to the individual fish. Spangled Grunter and Barred Grunter can also be extremely pugnacious. Don't keep Scats by themselves - must be kept in a group and Silvers will provide by far the bets display in a pond - you'll struggle to see the Reds as they blend in too much from above. Scats eat plants yes. These two threads seem identical...

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Hi,

There are a bunch of options available to you. Heres a few that havent been mentioned:

- Notesthes robusta - Bullrout

- Gymnothorax polyuranodon - Freshwater moray eel

- Anguilla australis - Short finned eel

- Oxyeleotris lineolata - Sleepy cod

- Scortum barcoo - Barcoo grunter/Jade perch (omnivores so will eat some green stuff).

Scats will trash your plants in no time at all. Silvers look good as they get older. Reds/greens dont look so great imo as they age.

Archers can be a problem if there just 2 of them. One will pick on the other. Either get 1 or 4+.

Snakehead gudgeons are very placid for their size. They are great because they add some colour to the aquarium.

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Unfortunatly no. Ive been chasing them for a little while myself. Last I heard they were selling for about $650 each. If I lived in Qld, id be planning a little fishing trip... They have a very small Australian distribution but are apparently quite abundent so should be reasonably easy to find :-)

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Unfortunatly no. Ive been chasing them for a little while myself. Last I heard they were selling for about $650 each. If I lived in Qld, id be planning a little fishing trip... They have a very small Australian distribution but are apparently quite abundent so should be reasonably easy to find :-)

They are an estuarine species that enters freshwater. Certainly would not class as abundant as far as known range - however that known range has little to no visability and is in croc country - so may be more prevalent - and have a wider distribution than currently known.

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I disagree none. I've not seen any information on the species that would classify them as estuarine. The adult population are an adaptable freshwater species.

They have a marine larval stage and then get themselves back up into freshwater.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21722111

http://fishesofaustralia.net.au/home/species/3814#moreinfo

http://www.perthcichlid.com.au/forum/index.php?showtopic=63032

Would be interested to see information to the contrary.

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Hi guys,

I know this has digressed a bit from OP's question but i just wanted to give anyone interested an opportunity to read the following research.Make up your own minds.

I have copy and pasted from a 2011 paper accessed through Edith Cowan University. I couldnt find the whole paper in free PDF form so had to view it through the ECU online library. Have included the full citation post-text.

...

Distribution

Analysis of 36 records of G. polyuranodon indicate that the adult phase (including juveniles) inhabit freshwater and mildly brackish habitats (salinity < 5) in Australia's Wet Tropics Adult phase G. polyuranodon has also been collected or observed in West Papua, Indonesia (Waigeo Island and Cenderawasih Bay), Papua New Guinea (Wewak, Manus Island, and near Madang) and Solomon Islands exclusively in pure fresh water, well above the high tide mark, and within c. 5–10 km of the sea (G. R. Allen, unpubl. data). Boseto & Jenkins (2006) reported five muraenid species from fresh water and brackish waters of Fiji. Only G. polyuranodon, however, was found almost exclusively in fresh water (D. Boseto, pers. comm.).

This study has substantially expanded the known distribution of G. polyuranodon within Australia and revealed that adult phase G. polyuranodon is capable of inhabiting fresh water at essentially any time of year (Fig. 6). Previously, the species was known from Cooper Creek and the Daintree River and was suspected of inhabiting estuaries and the lower reaches of streams between the Daintree River and Cape Tribulation along c. 30 km of coastline (Allen et al., 2002; Hagedoorn & Smallwood, 2007). The absence of G. polyuranodon from a number of previous freshwater fish studies in the Wet Tropics (Pusey & Kennard, 1996; Russell et al., 2003; Pusey et al., 2004; Rayner et al., 2008) is probably a function of both the rarity and the cryptic behaviour of the species. Gymnothorax polyuranodon is now known from 240 km of coastline including seven catchments in the Wet Tropics between Noah Creek and the North Johnstone River. It is also now known from the Endeavour River catchment, where the wet and dry tropics transition to the north of Cape Tribulation, indicating that this cryptic species may also occupy rivers of the dry tropics in Australia. On the basis of these data, it is concluded that G. polyuranodon is primarily a freshwater species. A useful next step in understanding the distribution of G. polyuranodon would be predicting the probable distribution of the species by modelling present data and environmental data as this has proved informative based on similarly low numbers of observations of other rare or elusive species (Pearson et al., 2007).

It is important to recognize that the detection of G. polyuranodon almost certainly differs according to habitat type and among freshwater, estuarine and marine ecosystems (Sutherland, 1998). Arguably, there is a positive bias towards observing this bottom-dwelling and cryptic species in freshwater systems as a function of typically decreased channel width and depth, relative to estuarine and inshore marine systems. Furthermore, there are marked differences in the survey and sampling gears typically used to study fishes in freshwater, estuarine and marine systems in the Wet Tropics (e.g. electrofishing in fresh water, nets and angling in estuaries, scuba diving on inshore reefs) as a function of the physical–chemical properties of these systems (e.g. water clarity, conductivity) (Perrow et al., 1998) and safety issues (e.g. crocodiles and box jellyfish). These differences in survey technique compromise current understanding of the habitat and ecosystem use of G. polyuranodon.

....

Ebner, B. C., Kroll, B., Godfrey, P., Thuesen, P. A., Vallance, T., Pusey, B., Allen, G. R., Rayner, T. S. and Perna, C. N. (2011), Is the elusive Gymnothorax polyuranodon really a freshwater moray?. Journal of Fish Biology, 79: 70–79. doi:10.1111/j.1095-8649.2011.02987.x

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It is important to recognize that the detection of G. polyuranodon almost certainly differs according to habitat type and among freshwater, estuarine and marine ecosystems (Sutherland, 1998). Arguably, there is a positive bias towards observing this bottom-dwelling and cryptic species in freshwater systems as a function of typically decreased channel width and depth, relative to estuarine and inshore marine systems. Furthermore, there are marked differences in the survey and sampling gears typically used to study fishes in freshwater, estuarine and marine systems in the Wet Tropics (e.g. electrofishing in fresh water, nets and angling in estuaries, scuba diving on inshore reefs) as a function of the physical–chemical properties of these systems (e.g. water clarity, conductivity) (Perrow et al., 1998) and safety issues (e.g. crocodiles and box jellyfish). These differences in survey technique compromise current understanding of the habitat and ecosystem use of G. polyuranodon.

....

Ebner, B. C., Kroll, B., Godfrey, P., Thuesen, P. A., Vallance, T., Pusey, B., Allen, G. R., Rayner, T. S. and Perna, C. N. (2011), Is the elusive Gymnothorax polyuranodon really a freshwater moray?. Journal of Fish Biology, 79: 70–79. doi:10.1111/j.1095-8649.2011.02987.x

Really not sure what point you are trying to make. That extract from your post is saying virtually the same thing as I stated in post 16.

Links have already been provided verifying the info as per your request.

I'm talking from first hand knowledge of the habitats not from what I've read from the other end of the country....

Believe what you will - really doesn't bother me but actually seeing the habitats for yourself may give you more knowledge to pass info onto others.

Edited by none

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The bit you bothered to quote does support part of what you said but the point of the paper was what???

The conclusion is clearly stated that adult G. polyuranodon are freshwater.

The links you provided were not great from a scientific point of view... wet web media... im not sure they have done a lot to further the worlds understanding of G. polyuranodon life cycle or behaviour.

There are other studies that have been conducted - for example by University of Tokyo - looking at the levels of strontium and other elements found in marine water within the target specimens. Those studies have revealed very low levels indicating that the specimens captured at least have probably spent their entire adult lives in fresh water.

I dont doubt your claims of first hand knowledge of their habitat but by disregarding the information I provided, you are saying that your experience and observations are better than the best peer reviewed scientific evidence available.

It seems pretty clear to me that there is at least a significant population of these eels living pretty well permanently in fresh water. I also have no doubt that there are populations inhabiting brackish waters. The scale of populations in either habitat are largely unknown and for the purposes of this discussion (keeping one in a freshwater aquarium), irrelevant.

The point is, evidence says there is no problem keeping G. polyuranodon in a freshwater aquarium.

But im happy to agree to disagree.

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