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Apistogramma ID - gephyra or agassizii

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I haven't got any of these, however there has been debate as to what they are.

They are either gephyra or a lovely blue form of Aggie. From the catchment where gephyra are caught apparantly there are blue aggies found (Rio Negro).

Apparantly the best guess to seperate is to look at the lateral band - In the male when aggressive in gephyra it should be solid all the way from gill to base of the tail, in the aggie it fades out about mid body length.

In brooding females again in Gephyra the band stays, in aggies you get a dot only.

Will eb interested to hear from the guys who got them so far what they do when a mirro is held up to them, and any reports on brooding female colours....

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Had the same thoughts myself but I think they are A.gephyra, as they are very close to the colours and shape of the fish described in this article. Jodi was commenting on the unusual colour of some of the fish in the shop tank, they were a spitting image of the subdominant female colouration in the article. I have never seen an A.agassizii female look like this.

http://www.dwarfcichlid.com/Apistogramma_gephyra.php

Cheers

T

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Couldn't get much info from the supplier - this is all he could tell me:

"Gephyra came from Columbia. The only information was that available was that they were collected in a small creek, that doesn't have a name, but that discharges into the Amazon"

As above - the females in this group can turn a very drab grey pattern. So much so I thought they were contaminants - but couldn't always find the "odd" ones when I had a reference book in my hand. Now I know why!

Cheers, J

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Mike W (Apistogramma.com forum expert) has suggested A. cf. agassizii Broad Black Caudal Seam as the ID. However he was operating without a locality at all. I think Columbia knock them out - not sure but so posed the question.

Interesting read here on those fish

http://www.mtfb.com/MTFBJuly2005/JULY20 ... ticle2.htm

Todd, I am with you on some of the colouration of females - never been so hard to pick female aggies - if they are aggies....

I should have grabbed a mirror and had a look at the pairs reaction while I was there yesterday - would be interesting to see what they do. (There was not enough action between them going on to draw much from there behaviour).

Personally I am buggered if I know which they are could be either. Will look forward to breeding/ further colouration reports.

Steve

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I also have bought a blue "pair" of A. gephyra from Fishchicks. But it should be noted that approximately 50% of the males in the batch at Fishchicks are yellow, rather than blue. As far as I know, there are no yellow forms of A. gephyra.

From what I have gathered so far in my research about A. gephyra, is that they have only been collected in the lower Rio Negro in Brazil.

A. agassizii forms have quite an extensive range right along the Rio Amazonas, from Peru almost to the mouth of the river in Brazil. Agassizii are found in many of the major rivers and streams in both countries that connect to the Amazon river.

There have also been recordings of Agassizii collected in the Rio Amazonas reaches of Columbia. Most Columbian occurances are within a close proximaty of the border town of Leticia or 100 kilometers further up the Rio Amazonas near Puerto Nariño. This branch of the Rio Amazons forms the border between Peru and Columbia and originates in Peru, rather than Columbia. There are northern branches of the Rio Amazonas that do originate in central Columbia, but I have been unable to find any reportings of Agassizii in these branches. So while Agassizii have been found in Columbia, they are more than likely closely related forms of some of the Peruvian forms of Agassizii.

If the apsito's are originally from Columbia and flown out of Leticia, I would suspect them to be a form of agassizii. If they are Gephyra, then they should have been flown of either Santarem or Manaus, Brazil. But as Steve has suggested, waiting for spawning behaviour may provide a better clue.

Peter

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Hi Guys

I love those fish, absolutely gorgeous - saw the post on apistogramma.com :)

Any decisions on the ID, for what its worth I would say those male pics are definately A. agassizi, specially from the blue speckling on the face and how it overlays the start of the lateral line (not diagnostic I know)

Good luck with the fish

Steph

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I now have a couple of new ID books for the shop, Datz, Aqualog, Cichlid atlas 1 & 2. They all have A.gephyra in them. On the Saturday if people come in to see the new shipment, we can try to work it out. Just to make it a little more confusing, A.gephyra come in Blue, blue with yellow tail , blue with blue tail , yellow , etc. all with the some location.

T

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Sorry Briztoon, I worded that wrong. The books are not for sale but at the shop for customers like yourself to look at if they want to find a particular apisto or more info of fish in the shop.

BUT if i could find these books at low enough prices for you guys to buy I would. The ones I have were hard enough to get as it is, specially the cichlid atlas set in english

The Datz book I bought from England

cichlid atlas 2 from Germany

cichlid atlas 1 from Melbourne, very happy with that find I can tell you.

cheers

T

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Cichlid Atlas 1 .. mmmmm - this one I dont have, my current info says its out of print but its being revised and will be reprinted in german and english again but no availability date.

Cichlid Atlas 2 i just got recently and am still digesting it ;)

Any one interested, I buy my books from http://www.stevensimpsonbooks.com/ Its a UK specialist firm and they are great, not too expensive and really prompt delivery.

Very interested on the final outcome, the new shipment is wildcaught ? (I love aggies, especially wildcaught ones!)

Cheers

Steph

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