japes Posted June 16, 2008 Report Share Posted June 16, 2008 Hey guys, Over the last few months I've tread very carefully around my tank as my fish have a tendency to randomly 'freak' or 'skit' out, that's really the only way I have of describing what they do. It's worried me from the start but it's at the stage where I really need to deal with it, as they're going to do damage to themselves sooner or later and I obviously don't want that to happen. When I'm approaching the tank, or the lights turn off (on a timer), or even sometimes what seems completely randomly, my fish, particularly my Eartheaters, will basically go balls out mental, flying into the sides of the tank and banging their heads on anything in the way. I understand fish can be freaked or skittish from sudden movements, but this isn't skittishness in my opinion, they are not scared of me once they realize that I'm there to feed them or clean the tank, they are not scared of my hands when they're in the tank either, in fact they're the exact opposite and will often pester me by inspecting what I'm doing. When I'm in front of the tank with the Camera and they realize it's me they're completely normal and their lively bustling selves. Just tonight when the lights turned off, a minute later I could hear bumping and banging and inspected with a torch to find my substrate all stirred up and some freaked out looking fish. I know from experience and guidance that A. heckelii are very easily startled fish, and I'm aware that they may be causing this problem as when one fish freaks out the rest seem to follow suit. As far as I could tell when it started, nothing was different. I used to run the tank without lids but due to both evaporation and this problem starting up I've been forced to use them. My bigger fish don't seem too worried about it, but they still display a level of uncertainty when the other fish freak out. Most times when I approach the tank to feed they will dart to cover for a second which I realize is quite normal, but maybe twice a week they will completely freak out. Tank sits in a corner, in my room, and there is not a lot of traffic in front of it other than when I need to tend to the tank or wake up/go to bed. The curtains are generally always drawn as it keeps algae down. I find it happens more often but not restricted to when I'm wearing a dark or black shirt, as even when I'm cleaning the tank shirtless (and they're exposed to my lovely moontan), the problem still occurs. Does anyone have any experience or input on this problem? I hate seeing my fish in such a panic that they could do damage to themselves. Cheers, Ryan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wetpetz Posted June 16, 2008 Report Share Posted June 16, 2008 G'day Ryan, I think some well chosen dither fish would help. I'd also be suspicious of low level toxins causing these sort of reactions. Carbon might help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
japes Posted June 16, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 16, 2008 I was sort of under the impression that dithers might not be the answer to this as they really aren't skittish fish, just startled. My choices are rather limited as I've got a male Chocolate Cichlid and 2 Severums in the tank currently and although they're sub-adults around the 5-6" mark currently, they may cause problems when they're larger, even to high-bodied Tetra. Dither's must be South American to fit with my tank theme too. I was initially curious as to whether or not possible contamination was the cause of this, with people saying a leaking heater could be a possible cause. Well the heaters been gone for a while now and it still exists, so I'll run carbon in my sump for a few days to see if there's any change in behaviour, then look into possible dithers from there. Just for clarification, stocking is 2x Heros efasciatus "Green Severum" 1x Hypselecara temporalis "Chocolate Cichlid" 1x Geophagus altifrons 'Rio Tocantins' 2x Acarichthys heckelii 3x Geophagus sp. 'Araguaia Orange Heads' 2x Ancistrus sp. "Bristlenose Pleco" 2x Crossocheilous siamensis "True Siamese Algae Eater" (Removing soon) Water parameters are what you'd expect. pH: 7.4 (Higher than I'd like) gH/kH: Unsure (need a test kit) Ammonia: 0ppm Nitrite: 0ppm Nitrate: 8-10ppm with weekly 30% water changes. Cheers, Ryan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avarice Posted June 17, 2008 Report Share Posted June 17, 2008 Hey mate, not sure on other fish here, but my peppermints were doing that right before, and while a plague of whitespot hit em. But now I have that under control they are quite placid once more. I'm still a fish newbie so that might have nothing to do with it whatsoever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
largeheaded1 Posted June 17, 2008 Report Share Posted June 17, 2008 my JD does that, but i have jus been moving them all around and she has seemed to calm down a bit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dem0n Posted June 18, 2008 Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 my salmontail catfish do the same thing... & they are big & can break plastic plants & knock rocks & driftwood around with thier mental thrashing. i have no idea what causes it coz they sometimes do it when i have been sitting there for a while motionless watching the tank. sometimes it spooks the other fish but most of the time the cichlids in the tank just quickly look in the salmontails direction with that 'free meal?' look :winktongue: & then go 'nah just salmontails' & go about thier business. previously when i had a tank in my bedroom all the fish would have a minor freakout when people were walking around the house which i attributed to wonky floorboards (1950's colonial house) making the whole tank 'sway'. haven't had that problem since moving all my tanks to my 'fishroom' which attaches to my garage & is on a concrete slab. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
japes Posted June 18, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 I've been running carbon since this morning and the fish appear to be less jumpy but I can't really confirm for a few days. So far no freak outs, just a slight "oh crap it's that guy again!" reaction. I'm still cautious about it as I've read writeups and reports about Carbon being a possible cause of HITH, but my water quality is great so I really shouldn't be too worried. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty Posted June 18, 2008 Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 haha 'nah just salmontails' bet they taste dirty. Yeah my americans do it sometimes when i come into the room, but the tank at the moment is just sitting on the floor as i haven't had a chance to do anything with it as of yet. Like demon was saying if it's on a surface that can translate vibrations that could be stirring them up a bit, and just remember to remove the carbon after about a week as it's lost pretty much all it's usefulness by then and might start leaching chemicals back into the water. Cheers, Rusty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
japes Posted June 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 Carbon seems to be making it slightly better but the fish are still quite jumpy, and I think it's due to stress. My tank managed to drop a few degrees (This Aquarworld 300W isn't cutting it by itself, waiting for Bayfish trip for an Eheim Jager), and the fish were noticably jumpier and stressed than usual. Recently the local water supply has changed, and my and pH reading rose from 7.1 which I was reasonably happy with, to 7.4 or so. I don't have a gH/kH test kit but I presume the waters also harder. I'll be picking up a gH/kH test kit on Bayfish trip day, as well as maybe getting a new pH test kit (Though I've had the same readings on two kits), so maybe this will shed some more light on the situation. They were least jumpy when the heat was up around 28-29 so I'll try and hold it up there instead of the usual 26-27. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clownie Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 japes, my fish have been doing that on and off for years. and it doesnt matter what type of fish ive had (sth american/african). when i approach my tank, if you walk normally over to it they scatter a bit but if you crouch down like youre getting their container of food out, theyre fine. maybe an instinctive thing, approching them at their level rather than from above (like a bird/predator in the wild perhaps). i know that prob sounds stupid, but... it IS annoying tho, people come over to visit and say, "oh arent they nice fish" and then walk up and WHAM, big freak-out. i have to warn people first good to see it not just my fish eh.... cheers col Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
japes Posted June 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 japes, my fish have been doing that on and off for years. and it doesnt matter what type of fish ive had (sth american/african). when i approach my tank, if you walk normally over to it they scatter a bit but if you crouch down like youre getting their container of food out, theyre fine. maybe an instinctive thing, approching them at their level rather than from above (like a bird/predator in the wild perhaps). i know that prob sounds stupid, but...it IS annoying tho, people come over to visit and say, "oh arent they nice fish" and then walk up and WHAM, big freak-out. i have to warn people first Exactly my problem and original theory, but it just seems so on and off or moody that I'm not sure it's the only problem. A few of us had a big late night chat last night regarding my problems and a few possible causes were raised, including my tanks positioning. I realise my tank positioning isn't ideal as I need to approach from the side which causes refraction with the glass and probably looks like I'm a big Arapaima gigas coming in for a snack, and this is also confirmed with black shirts being a common trigger. I think it's a combination of being stressed (from something), combined with my approaches towards the tank. I'm slowly working me way through finding a cure to the problem so I'll keep this post updated. Some of my plans.. - Checking water hardness to make sure it's soft enough - Adding more driftwood for cover (Might also help with hardness) as my tank is quite open to the front. - Keeping a higher than average temperature (28~) - Covering the side of my tank up if worse comes to worst. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dumpie Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 its happens with my tanks most of the time i find that when i trun only one lights of and then another one about 5 mins later it gives the fish time to calm down because it allows them to adjust to the low light and when you go and turn the other light of there pretty good but when you turn the lights of together it freaks em out heaps cuz there like holy shit its dark so they bolt soi find if i sorta work them down to the low light it helps but thats just me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Braddo Posted June 22, 2008 Report Share Posted June 22, 2008 This is one of the great mysteries of the fish world, raising the temp will more than likely make them more jumpy as the fishes motabolism will increase. Also water starts to lose its oxygen content at 29 so not really recomended dither fish will be a big help as it makes fish more comfortable to see smaller fish swimming around. I would recomend rainbows for the cichlilds your keeping as their activity will take their mind off you. Plus they are quick and can get out of the way of the bigger cichlids. Both the cichlids you have really havent got the mouth size to take a full grown rainbow anyway. Fish will always be weary of us humans just their natural habits. you have to remember in the wild all their predators come from either above or the side so anything larger than them coming form either of these angles is regarded as a predator. Hence the flight reaction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
